Theology Panel: Notes
I offer these notes to provide some insights into the energy four of us shared during last Monday's Theology Panel conference call. As these are just my notes I invite Rev. Roger, Rev. Jim and Rev. Nancy to add their notes to these.
Rev. Roger noted that he was from the Prince of Peace congregation in Anniston, AL. Raised Baptist he moved to the Anglican Church, but due to internal church politics in their first church where I believe he said his wife was unsuccesfully nominated for Bishop, he and his wife left and joined a progressive Anglican church. He's now part of the creation effort building The Progressive Christian Alliance, a "non-denominational denomination"! He does enjoy a good social justice campaign and a good theological discussion.
The Rev. Jim Ramelis, who lives "way out in the sticks" of the Upper Peninsula of Michigan, has a degree in Religious Studies. His studies in A Course in Miracles lead to his ordination. He's prime interest is in the basics of social justice; would like CrossLeft to push for basic universal progressive themes such as immigration reform, universal healthcare for all and the like.
The Rev. Nancy Detweiler attended two seminaries, 30 years apart. She lives in Richmond, VA, started as a Baptist, then tried the Episcopal church, followed that by joining the Disciples of Christ church, then moved on to the Unity School of Christianity where she was ordained. Unfortunately the call was disconnected as she started to add her interests.
Myself, Rich Warden, like the other three have followed an evolving path to self awareness and enlightenment. I started life in the Methodist Church, where many of my mothers uncles and cousins were ordained, in college joined a Unitarian-Universalist church (served on the Board of Trustess and the Ministerial Search Committee) After 15 years, moved on to a Religious Science church, studied Ernest Holmes' Science of Mind, and like Rev. Jim A Course in Miracles. After that, like Rev. Nancy moved on to Unity where I studied the life and works of the Fillmore's. After serving on the Board of Trustees and having found the experience very traumatic, my wife and I moved on to a Spiritualist church where she served on the Board of Trustees. Along the way I was ordained into the Order of Melchizedek, performing a numer of weddings and funerals, the first of the latter was for my mother.
My marriage adds deeply to my path of exploration. My wife's father served as a minister in the Disciples of Christ church for 40+ years. I presently describe myself as a Deist.
Due to technical difficulties with the free conference call hook up we did not have time to delve into the purpose of the Theological Panel and how it would serve us and our progressive Christian community on line and at large.
All in all the energy on the call was wonderful to swim in. We look forward to many future uplifting calls and on line exchanges. What a joy is it to find folks of like mind.
I'd like to hear more from Rev. Roger, Rev. Nancy, Rev. Jim and many others on this site re: your personal spiritual journey. Please - do share!
Cheers and peace to all.
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Interesting
This sounds like a very interesting call indeed. What will be the format for these calls moving forward?
Our founder
Kety,
As the visionary who started this whole CrossLeft community, I'm happy you have joined in this part of the vision that now has started to grow. I invite you to share, here, with the whole community what prompted you to start CrossLeft. Beyond what I know already, I'd love to hear more myself.
My reason for initiating this panel was to help us all get better aquainted with progressive Christian theology, to share our philosphy of life, how we each have traveled our inner journey, to share books we've read and help us all answer the challenges our more conservative Christian community members present us. Like you Kety, I do not for one moment believe the Robertson's in our midst world wide have all the answers. Here we can develop on line what Rev. Roger is doing, building a Progressive Christian Alliance. Let us regain our wider spiritual vision; the one that worked to end slavery, gain women the right to vote and workers the right to organize. Now we have undocumented workers, just trying to get their piece of the cosmic pie for themselves to champion.
As for the format well I'd like to start each call w/ a check in, introducing ourselves one to another, especially new folks. It is a great joy for me to actually hear the voices of our fellow progressives, to feel their energy, to be inspired by it and to learn oh so much more. Lord we have such deep souls here, with so much in common, and with so much diversity that we stimulate the growth of each who has been divinely guided to come by, sit down on the community porch and "chew the fat" as we used to say back home.
I'd like to next ask folks on the call what brings them here, what their personal passions are, and how the panel can assist them in achieving our individual goals. I am always eager to hear the fire we all have in our belly. This would lend itself directly to exploring and further defining what the purpose of the panel would be, and how we can focus our energy in the most productive manner. I see it having a serious theological intent, building a progressive Christian theology, while having some fun along the way.
If we have time I'd like to explore more the particular topics of interest to each community member, each new friend. For instance, for 3 decades my personal focus been on the connections between science and religion. To me it is science and, not vs, religion. I am about to launch a series here on just that. I firmly believe that science and religion are talking about the same thing, just using different languages, speaking to different audiences. In this community I hear expressions of the wisdom of both the head and the heart. Our Creator gave us both, let us use them wisely.
It's a daunting task, but one that reflects the fire in my belly. The challenge will be to bring forth the wisdom of both my head and heart. More about this later.
So, this is the vision I see, so far. BTW we need not be restricted to one call/per month. If we desire we could get on line every other Monday. Meanwhile we have this wonderful site, so lovingly administered by our friend Steve Rockwell, to explore our world together. Lord I feel like a kid in a candy store, a vast cosmic candy store so full of goodies I just don't know what candy to gobble first!
So I invite you all to stop by the store and get a piece of the sweets of life here for yourself. Come find a front porch rocker, sit a spell, share your secret recipes, tell us what's up in your life and what else you'd like to gab about. Maybe we can even do some serious exploring along the way.
Rich
1 final podcast... What it Takes to Build a Movement
1 final response to Rich's inquiry... in the form of a podcast:
What it Takes to Build a Movement: What is the legacy left by the Civil Rights Movement?
Submitted by Kety on Tue, 11/01/2005 - 00:40
Front page article in the NY Times today,
"Grieving Parks, Rights Leaders Ponder Future."
There is an inquiry in this article. It asks, "What is the future of the legacy left by the Civil Rights movement?"
As a progressive Christian it strikes me that the answer is clear.
(Follow the link & you will find my podcast & some thoughts.)
http://www.crossleft.org/node/425
The beginning (Progressive Christians: Raise your voices 7/17/05
Rich, you write:
"As the visionary who started this whole CrossLeft community, I'm happy you have joined in this part of the vision that now has started to grow. I invite you to share, here, with the whole community what prompted you to start CrossLeft. Beyond what I know already, I'd love to hear more myself."
In response to your inquiry/invitation, I am including a few blog posts from three years past now which might shed some light on your question... Hope this provides a good start. :-) Also, I might have been the first to have the vision but have been thrilled to have handed it off over the course of the last few years and through leadership such as yours, Steve's, Mark's, Frank's and now Jim's and the rest of the growing community seen it flourish & grow.
Here's the first post I will publish again for you...
Progressive Christians: Raise your voices
Submitted by Kety on Sun, 07/17/2005 - 02:30
http://www.crossleft.org/node/40
This morning as I was writing the Frequently Asked Questions page for CrossLeft, I took a break and came across an article written by John C. Danforth, an Episcopal minister and former Republican senator from Missouri and I realized that even though I am progressive politically, much of what he was saying was quite similar to what I am saying as a progressive Christian.
In fact, in his article Danforth issues a call to action to Christians who hold convictions like mine.
He says that we should add our clear voice of moderation to the debate on religion in politics, which is exactly what we are working to do here at CrossLeft.
When people ask me why we''ve created CrossLeft, I tell them that we are doing this because we care about our faith and about the state of our nation.
We believe that as progressive Christians we have the responsibility to bring our progressive Christian values into the world.
We believe that the increased activism of the Christian right has produced an imbalanced view of Christianity and that this has had an adverse impact on our nation''s politics and policies and therefore our country and ultimately the world.
We believe that it is time that there be a movement to recenter the conversation as it relates to Christianity and to our core Christian values. Moreover, as progressive Christians, we reject the notion that religion is defined by a set of wedge issues used by expedient politicians at election time.
We believe that Christ taught us to be tolerant and to reach out to those we disagree with.
He taught us to be inclusive.
He sat with tax collectors and with sinners. He welcomed them to the table and taught us that we should do as did he.
He taught us to love God, our self and our neighbor.
As children we are taught that for Christians the Golden Rule and love is the foundation for all other commandments.
As progressive Christians, we believe that we can not accept a political agenda that does not speak to, model and act on that love. And we believe that as Christians we must be in action around that core value of our faith.
This is a critical time in the history of our great nation and the world.
We can not be mere spectators.
We have a moral obligation to raise our voices, take responsibility and engage in dialog. And through this dialog, we believe that our movement will help to re-frame the conversation that is being had as it relates to Christianity.
...
R's ?: Progressive Christians- The Voice of Few or ...
In response to Rich's question, here is yet another repost which I think reflects the premise from which we began...
Progressive Christians- The Voice of Few or the Voice of Many?
Submitted by Kety on Wed, 10/26/2005 - 13:09
http://www.crossleft.org/node/367
There are those that think that we, progressive Christians, are only a handful of people- the voice of a few. I disagree. I believe that we are the voice of many- perhaps even that which will at some point be coined the new "silent majority". And if not silent, at least an unseen majority, a majority that is in action but whose story is not being picked up by the press and mainstream on a daily basis, at least not yet.
In the course of the last few months, as we have established CrossLeft, I have come to realize that there are a good number of us who are working on furthering the cause of progressive Christianity. We are indeed many and diverse and committed. This presents an exciting though challenging proposition for us. How do we let the world know that in the US there are many progressive Christians in action in their politics and their faith? What will it take so that it is clear that there is a movement of progressive Christians?
I think it will take just that, a movement. Much work that has been done to date on this front, but in my 30 years of life, I have yet to see an interdenominational, progressive Christian movement. The good news is, I think we are about to get there. I think we are reaching the tipping point. Many progressive Christians are fed up with the status quo and want to do something about it. Many are in action and many more are starting to link in. I think back to Rosa Parks' quote,
"At the time I was arrested I had no idea it would turn into this. It was just a day like any other day. The only thing that made it significant was that the masses of the people joined in."
I wonder if that day will be today. I think we should all go about our work and our commitment to this cause as if it might be. At CrossLeft.org we are committed to being in action and doing all we can to contribute to making this happen.
In the spirit of furthering the strength of the large progressive Christian community, at CrossLeft.org we have created a site that pulls together information on/from all of the different players, while creating an online community for progressive Christians. We are both a portal and a community. It is our opinion that our strength and ability to build a movement will only come from the collective voice of all of the progressive Christian movers and shakers who care about their faith and are doing something about it.
We think that it is important that we harness our collective progressive Christian energy in a way that we are all connected and know what we are doing so that we can work together and contribute to each other and the building of a movement. To that end we have been asking the leaders of other progressive Christian groups to share their events and initiatives with CrossLeft and we have been posting everything we receive on our website. (If you have information to send about a particular group, please send it to us too. Or better yet, join our community and blog about it yourself.)
Moreover, in order to take this work to the next level, we are hoping to bring together the leaders of several progressive Christian organizations for a summit this winter. Our target: February '06 in San Francisco. Please stay tuned to CrossLeft, as we will be posting more information on this summit as the date approaches.
We are presently looking for partner organizations to join us as hosts of this summit. If you are a leader in the progressive Christian movement and are interested in helping us host and/or if you would like to put us in touch with someone else who you think would be great for this, please e-mail us at info@crossleft.net. Please note that while this is a leadership summit for leaders of this movement, we define leaders as not only those in traditional leadership roles, but also those who have taken action and define themselves as leaders in the grassroots and the netroots. So, if you are interested in being a part of this summit, please send us a note and let us know!
Progressive in hiding
Kety,
You said "There are those that think that we, progressive Christians, are only a handful of people- the voice of a few. I disagree. I believe that we are the voice of many- perhaps even that which will at some point be coined the new "silent majority". And if not silent, at least an unseen majority, a majority that is in action but whose story is not being picked up by the press and mainstream on a daily basis, at least not yet."
I know for a fact that you are correct. There are many of us out there. I work with and minister to people every day that are progressives in hiding. There are many of us who continue attending our churches (or even ministering in our churches) that have a concept of Christianity that is far more progressive than the percieved norm within their particular church or denomination.
From my own experience:
A Southern Baptist pastor who confessed to me that he is constantly troubled that he "has" to preach things he does not believe; and envies me my ability to say what I feel led to say "consequences be damned".
A 20 - year+ Sunday School teacher who tearfully thanked us for "preaching what (we) preach" although she could "never go to (our) church because it is too radical for this area"
Those are just a couple of folks who have blessed me with their sharing recently. I know there are many more out there, remaining silent because they think they are alone... Just waiting for a more progressive, grace-filled voice to rise above the din.
Oh...the harm that has been done!
Roger,
Having worked with those who left the church in disgust, anger, and deep hurt, your two examples tugged at my heart. When people leave church, then proclaim that they are "recovering" Baptist, Catholic, whatever" the implication is heartrending. "Recovering" denotes a serious disfunction within the well-being of an individual. Jesus healed with love; the churches have created and perpetuated disease.
The difference between the loving, gentle (but strong) Jesus and what the churches have done to members is beyond comprehension. The destruction of self-esteem, the fear of saying something "wrong" while teaching Sunday School or in a sermon, the constant vigilance of some members to ensure nothing outside orthodoxy is mentioned, the spiritual hunger unattended ... why? Why engage in such behavior?
Crossleft will serve a marvelous purpose if it only succeeds in exposing the personal harm that has resulted from placing limits on the search for Truth.
Conference Call Information
Rich,
I need to make one correction ... I am ordained through what use to be the Federation of Independent Unity Churches, Inc. ... now called the Conference for Practical Christianity. The Federation was originally created to allow people who had attended seminary, but not the Unity School of Christianity, to become ordained Unity ministers. For legal reasons, the Federation name had to be changed.
I am also ordained in the Order of Melchizedek. I seldom use "Rev." because I no longer perform the functions of a minister, with the exception of my website. For several years now, my focus has been on researching and writing.
Charles Fillmore's books and Unity's Metaphysical Bible Dictionary play a major role in my writings. I also studied Ernest Holmes and Science of Mind. The Essene Community and writings are valuable in forming my concept of Jesus and his role in our lives. Edgar Cayce readings introduced me to the study of metaphysics.
For whatever reason, The Course in Miracles never grabbed me. I have a copy, but could never get interested ... perhaps because much of it is stated elsewhere in Fillmore and Holmes's writings.
Edmond Bordeaux Szekely's translations of the Dead Sea Scrolls which he found in the Secret Archives of the Vatican and called the "Essene Gospel of Peace" grabs my heart. He also wrote "The Essene Jesus: A Revaluation From the Dead Sea Scrolls." We visited Qumran, where the Dead Sea Scrolls were found, on one of my trips to the Middle East. I knew then and now that I have been an Essene in a former incarnation ... that the method the Essenes used to study the Bible is why I so deeply relate to a metaphysical interpretation of the Bible.
I find it fascinating that Fillmore knew his Soul to have been the Apostle Paul. Fillmore actually healed himself (through prayer) of one leg being shorter than the other; Paul spoke often of his own affliction.
Many familiar with Edgar Cayce believe him to have been a reincarnation of Luke, the physician thought to have written the Gospel of Luke.
Edgar Cayce, as the most scientifically documented intuitive in history, listed several incarnations of Jesus: among them Melchizedek (whom Cayce states wrote the Book of Job)and the Psalmist Asaph, who wrote Psalm 82 among others. I reference Psalm 82 because in John 10:34, Jesus states: "Is it not written in your law, I said, "you are gods'?" In Pslam 82:6, Asaph writes: "I say, 'You are gods.'" Glenn Sanderfur's "Lives of the Master: The Rest of the Jesus Story" is a fascinating read--based on the Edgar Cayce readings.
If, as I believe, all of this is true, Fillmore as the Apostle Paul, Edgar Cayce as Luke, and Jesus as Melchizedek and Asaph wrote portions of the Bible--portions that have become favorites of many Christians today. I look forward to the discovery of additional texts written by Jesus.
The spiritual seeker journeys on an exciting path in search of more and more Truth! We have so much to learn!
And what an interesting group of people we have on Crossleft! I love listening to each individual's story!
Come on in, the water is fine.
I agree with your assesment re: Progressive Christian. To my thinking it expresses appreciation for the wonderfully variagated threads that we all are in this grand tapestry in the making. (cheesy, I know)
Progressive Christian Alliance
Rev. Roger,
I remember you telling us here a few weeks ago about the Progressive Christian Alliance you are participating in creating. It got lost somewhere in the blogisphere. Would you tell the CL commmunity more about it? I am intrigued by your description of it on Monday's call. You referred to it as being a "non-denominational denomination". If you would, please blog it so it will remain more easily accessible for future reference. Thanx.
Rich
One small correction....
We left the "progressive" Anglican church because of their restrictive traditional views of the episcopacy and finding ourselves independent, sought to build a "non-denominational denomination" welcoming to all who consider themselves Christian and progressive, regardless of their particular doctrines, believing that there "is more to unite us than divides us".
I greatly enjoyed meeting all of you and eagerly await our next discussion. The panel present on Monday showed me once again, how wonderfully varied and rich our paths are. I look forward to learning from you all.
Amateur Huston Smith
We had such a short time and so much to tell and express I really didn’t get into many details. I am sort of an amateur Huston Smith. Huston Smith was a Religious historian and author who not only wrote about his subject matter but entered into them fully and studied with Zen masters , Yogis, and Rabbis , as well as being a Christian minister in his own right.
One of my parents was Catholic and one was Protestant so I started off ecumenical. I bounced back and forth between Catholicism and Protestantism with ease for many years. What others saw as a huge chasm in Christianity was merely a crack in the sidewalk that I easily stepped over.
I lived in Israel for several months and studied Judaism with rabbis as a Jew would. Seeing Jesus as a Jew is very reality based and leads to depths of understanding sometimes missed by mainstream Christinaity.
I am a long term meditator and have practiced a variety of techniques over the years. I find mediation a valuable precursor to prayer.
I have had many similar experiences to the others on the call, having studied New Thought, including Religious Science and Ernest Holmes. There are incredible similarities between New Thought and A Course in Miracles. A Course in Miracles helped me re-discover the Bible all over again.
A normal morning for me might consist of meditation using a yogic pranayama to quiet everything down , then a minute or more of peace and quiet, then using my Holy Spirit given mantra of “Love” for several minutes or more ,accepting Christ’s love, and then praying to give that love to my brothers and sisters, and finally asking the Lord what he would have me do and being quiet. Prayer for me is never “I want, I want” or “Lord give me, give me”. That is prayer of a lower order. I spend some reading time almost every morning in the Bible, or reading some other spiritual work such as A Course In Miracles or perhaps some words from the Buddha. Yoga postures and Chi Kung would come later. I have been doing yoga off and on for many years and practiced martial arts as a young man but now it takes the form of Chi Kung movements.
I substitute pastor at a local community church that I attend with my family and have been toying with the idea of starting a Progressive Christian talk group, with the possibility of it evolving into a church. Perhaps Rev. Roger could give me few pointers on that. Marcus Borg has heavily influenced me and I feel comfortable as a “Progressive Christian”. As people like putting a label on things, I think “Progressive Christian” will be my last label used to describe my seemingly complex faith. I know though it is actually a simple faith that in his commandments of “ Love God” and “Love your neighbor as yourself” Jesus well sums it up and indeed catches the essence of all the great faiths of the world.